We operate 10GHz EME, mainly WSJT but occasionally CW at the moment, so
this is only one viewpoint.
All that is possible in some cases, and all that is needed, is an
exchange of Callsigns/Signal reports to prove a contact has been made.
All contacts are about the same distance. The mode used is a secondary
consideration.
There are a wide variety of issues when considering EME from 6m to
24GHz+: signal strength, mode, libration, timing/skeds etc, so
requirements will be different for each.
Given the difficulty in putting together large stations, some form of
hierarchy in points in terms of bandwidth may be useful - eg SSB - CW -
Data. Do this by having separate sections if you like, but make it easy
to submit logs. All I want is to maximise the activity/chance of QSOs.
For most stations, it is not about winning. It is about having the
opportunity to have QSOs. You will get more entries if you keep the
requirements simple.
Whether CW or Digimode, I value the signal strength exchange. Signal
reports are a vital part of the contact, both for interest, and knowing
at what rate to proceed. Trying to strip everything out of the exchange
to give the absolute minimum QSO time does not seem to me what EME is
about. It would be a very retrograde step if all contacts degenerated
into an exchange of 599 regardless, as on the HF bands.
It is useful to have both the signal report and Grid in Digimodes, as
they come "free" in WSJT. It also gives a hard copy of the exchange.
If CW exchanges don't have the Grid, that need not be a problem. ARRL
can work out the Grids/Country multipliers afterwards if necessary, when
the entries are received. It does not matter if I am not sure of the
score when sending the entry in.
The ARRL EME contest is a focus for worldwide activity. Two sessions per
band per year doesn't seem excessive, and is good for activity.
We have found the ARRL EME entry format a bit uncertain. It would help
if they specified more of the variables, eg time window for a contact,
what is actually required in the exchange, and that the location can be
sent in with the entry.
Julian, G3YGF, obo G4RFR
On 08/12/2022 01:22, Marshall-K5QE via Moon-net wrote:
> Hello to all EME ops that are serious about changing the EME contest
> for the better. Recent discussions on Moon-Net have exposed two big
> problems with the exchange of the contest and the scoring. These
> are: A)the multiplier is NOT part of the exchange and B)scoring and
> submitting a log is MUCH more difficult than it should be(See A).
>
> Two reasonable proposals have been made to fix the EME contest
> scoring. The first is by Jay-N1AV and the second is by myself,
> Marshall-K5QE. I am going to post these two ideas and ask that the
> community come to some conclusion, which can then be formally proposed
> to the ARRL Contest group.
>
> PROPOSAL 1:
>
> NOTE: I have slightly edited Jay's email, but the gist of the idea is
> completely his. Here is Jay's proposal: I would support a movement to
> change the rules from a state / country multiplier to a GRID
> multiplier. There, I said it. GRIDS. Here is why:
>
> A)Every other VHF contest uses grids as the multiplier. For the
> participant, no operation software changes needed, no logging software
> changes needed, and it is easier to log and submit. We want more,
> not less, ops to take part. We have already seen on moonet active
> EMEs who are not getting on or not submitting scores due to the work
> involved to post process logs. Going with grids is native to current
> digital software. It is part of the exchange and the culture of VHF
> contests.
>
> B)Using grids multipliers would increase scores. Who cares if the DX
> is in France or Germany, or a station is in North or South Carolina as
> the grid borders both areas. The actual grid is the tangible
> multiplier, not the unknown state that participants need to come up
> with.... New grid - all the VHF logging software TELLS you this.
>
> C)It will also INCREASE activity on the bands. This is what we want,
> MORE participation. Right now, there are 4 active EME ops on 1296 in
> multiple grids in Arizona. Currently in the EME contest if someone
> works 1 of us, they have worked AZ and they are off looking for other
> multipliers. The other 3 guys get pushed aside or missed. This
> happened in this last contest. Moving to grids, you now have 2-4
> multipliers all calling and all a priority to work!
>
> D)The second big point is that going to grids would ALSO ENCOURAGE EME
> ROVER operation (what a time to be alive!). Some of us were able to
> take advantage of Wyatt, AC0RA who setup and roved in two different
> states this last EME contest. But 99% of the folks out there didn't
> know he was in a new state when they saw his signal from weekend to
> weekend. They just thought "dupe" and moved on. If we used grids,
> there would be an immediate flag as a NEW grid with the current
> digital mode software. Using states as the multiplier it is unknown
> data. With the advent of the folding dishes in the past several years
> there is a much higher chance of these rovers going out and activating
> 2, 3, 4 grids off the moon during the contest. How exciting would
> that be! Pile up city for these rovers and MORE activity!
>
> Jay's Discussion: I have only been serious about EME contesting for 5
> years since I moved out here to AZ and got the stations online. I
> played with it back in Maine in the 90s. I have never understood using
> a state as a multiplier as it is not part of the exchange. I don't
> have software that tells me where I stand with my contest score as
> I participate. All my scoring software is grid based. State based
> multipliers are HF contest thinking. VHF contests have always been
> about grids and that works well.
>
> There - my three cents. Not sorry - but maybe it is time to change
> things up.
>
> - Jay N1AV
>
>
>
>
> PROPOSAL 2:
>
> Hello to all EME ops. I want to make a formal proposal for the
> EME contest exchange. The problem here is that the multiplier is
> NOT part of the exchange. This seems to me to be a poor way to
> run a railroad. I certainly do not pay any attention to HF
> contests, but I can't recall an HF contest where the multiplier is
> NOT part of the exchange, there may be one out there somewhere,
> but that is their problem....
>
> I would like to see the log entries be <DATE & TIME> <BAND> <HIS
> CALL> <MY CALL> and <STATE>(not necessarily in that order). As
> someone pointed out, if STATE is the multiplier, then grid cannot
> not used, because it is not unique(a single grid often covers more
> than one state). The numeric "signal reports" are of little
> value, since they are not compared to anything. Currently, they
> just have to be there. Why have these things at all??
>
> This would require the WSJT programmers to make up a new "skin",
> but it would be very close to what is now used for Field Day, so
> it should not be terribly difficult.
>
> Some discussion concerning <STATE> is in order. Obviously, for
> me, the <STATE> would be <TX>. For the Canadians, it would be
> their province(ON, SK, etc.). Then for the others, we could have:
>
> The <STATE> to be the numeric DXCC code as already defined by
> ARRL. So, all German stations would send <230>, the Falkland
> Islands would send <141>, while the South Orkney Islands would
> send <238>, and the South Sandwich Islands would send <240>.
> Since these identifiers are *UNIQUE*, it would make logging and
> scoring much easier. There are actually 5 different DXCC entities
> that have the VP8 callsign and this idea would make the actual
> <STATE> clear to everyone. There are several other examples of
> this problem(where the same call sign prefix covers more than one
> DXCC entity).
>
> These changes are relatively small and simple. We have almost a
> year to get this done.....
>
> Your comments and ideas??
>
> Marshall's Discussion: When I first thought up my idea, I thought
> it was a good one that would solve all the problems. Well, it
> would, but Jay's idea would do that as well. His idea does not
> require ANY changes in software, scoring, log entries, and so on,
> because we all know how to do that now. For that reason, I would
> recommend his method over mine.
>
> To all EME ops, please think about these two ideas and let's reach
> some kind of consensus. If I understood Bart's(W9JJ) last letter,
> that is what we are going to need to get any kind of movement on
> this problem.
>
>
> 73 Marshall K5QE
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moon-Net posting and subscription instructions are athttp://www.nlsa.com/nets/moon-net-help.html
>
-------- Weitergeleitete Nachricht --------
Betreff: Re: [Moon-Net] Moon-Net list temporarily offline
Datum: Tue, 21 Feb 2023 11:43:25 +0000
Von: Rainer <df6na(a)df6na.de>
An: rob(a)itr-datanet.com
Hi,
you are free to use for that time:
Moon(a)moonbounce.info
http://moonbounce.info/mailman/listinfo/moon
73, Rainer
Am 21.02.2023 um 10:12 schrieb Rob Hardenberg via Moon-net:
> Hi Moonbouncers,
>
> Announcement!
>
> Moon-Net will be offline for a few days starting this afternoon.
> I have to remove the server running moon-net from the data center
> tomorrow.
> I'm trying to move everything to a virtual machine as soon as possible.
> Moon-net has my attention, but attention is first on other services
> that need to be transferred.
>
> I'll put a message on moon-net when the maillist is back.
>
>
> 73 Rob PE1ITR
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moon-Net posting and subscription instructions are athttp://www.nlsa.com/nets/moon-net-help.html
>
Hi Moonbouncers,
Announcement!
Moon-Net will be offline for a few days starting this afternoon.
I have to remove the server running moon-net from the data center
tomorrow.
I'm trying to move everything to a virtual machine as soon as possible.
Moon-net has my attention, but attention is first on other services
that need to be transferred.
I'll put a message on moon-net when the maillist is back.
73 Rob PE1ITR
I’ve got a strange problem with my 1296 LNA. I have it installed at the
antenna in a box with relays for sequencer control. When I power it
everything is fine for a short time and then you can obviously hear it quit
when the RX level drops. Any idea what might be wrong with the LNA? New
ones are hard to come by it seems.
Rick, W2JAZ
--
Sent from Gmail Mobile
Hello friends, starting from February 24, 2023, the P50EME memorial station will operate.
We will be glad to hear from you on the 144 and 432 MHz bands.
Our station UA5Y will be busy in the DUBUS EME contest and will be able to switch to digital mode only intermittently this weekend as R50EME. The rest of the days we will try to be more active and possibly add 1296MHz and 10GHz bands weather permitting.
All stations will receive a special QSL card for making two-way QSOs.
A bit of history:
50 years ago, on January 8, 1973, the Luna-21 station was launched from the Baikonur Cosmodrome. A week later, she made a successful landing on the moon, delivering to its surface on January 15, 1973, the remotely controlled self-propelled planetary rover Lunokhod-2.
The mass of the station was 5700 kg, "Lunokhod-2" - 836 kg.
Lunokhod-2 worked for four months, transmitting 86 panoramas and about 80,000 television frames to Earth, and traveled 39 kilometers, which is about four times more than its predecessor, the Lunokhod-1 self-propelled planetary rover.
The work of the self-propelled planetary rover "Lunokhod-2" has become an important stage in the exploration of outer space by mankind with the help of automatic planetary stations.
Alexander RA3EME
73!
--
Александр Кретов
Отправлено из Почты Mail.ru
Hello!
Please help me test the new version of Q65 that I will be using during my upcoming 6m
EME DXpedition to 3B9! On Saturday, March 18, I plan to be QRV from 1400-2100Z on
144.110 calling CQ in the first sequence Q65-60A using NA VHF CONTEST MODE at an
offset of 1500 Hz. This time period includes the moonset in western EU as well as
moonrise in JA, ZL and the eastern half of VK. It is important to test the program in
as much of a "pileup situation" as I am able to create, to simulate the type of
activity encountered during a real VHF EME DXpedition. Please spread out (ideally
every 50 Hz), coordinating on the N0UK JT65 EME page. With my K3, I should be able to
see callers on offsets between 300 and 2700 Hz (please take your doppler shift into
account when picking an offset to start calling, and then stay there!).
Please download WSJTX v2.6.1 (or later version, if there is one by then) from the
following site:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/wsjt/
And then select the "SPECIAL OPERATING ACTIVITY" and "NA VHF" options on the
"FILE/SETTINGS/ADVANCED" screen. Please set up the program as outlined on my "SETUP
CHECKLIST" page below EXCEPT DO NOT ENABLE THE AVERAGE, since I will be changing my
messages frequently to reply to other callers:
http://www.bigskyspaces.com/w7gj/Q65SETUP.pdf
Of particular interest at this point are the following improvements that K1JT has
recently made to the program I will be using on my end:
1. The Q65 decoder has been enhanced for better performance.
2. WSJT-X has new features designed to help manage a weak-signal pileup
situations such as those experienced by VHF EME DXpeditions. In NA Contest Mode,
messages exchange 4-character locators rather than signal reports. Decoder "memory"
provides q3-level sensitivity for up to 40 callers decoded at least once in the past
24 hours, and for whom the Moon is still above the horizon.
What this means is that if I have successfully decoded a caller, I will see full
decodes from any subsequent transmissions detected from that caller, just as if I had
entered his call and grid into the DX CALL and DX GRID boxes for a one-on-one sked
using Q65-60A in WSJT-X v2.6.1. This is a HUGE advantage in EME pileup situations! I
will be saving all my .wav files for K1JT to further evaluate the actual on the air
tests.
In addition to the greater sensitivity of Q65-60A, using the NA CONTEST MODE is fast,
and should make it a great choice for 2m DXpeditions - especially as the moon is
rising and/or setting in different parts of the world and many stations are using
ground gain or losing common moon window at the same time! Please use RRR instead of
RR73, as it may take several sequences for me to be able to copy your final RRR and
complete the contact. Depending on the size of the pileup, after I receive your RRR,
I may send 73, or I may immediately reply to another caller. I am looking forward to
the tests on March 18, and hope as many of you as possible can get on and call me!
And of course, if you still need Montana or DN27 on 2m, this is a great opportunity
for a contact!
MNI MNI TNX! VY 73, Lance
--
Lance Collister, W7GJ(ex WA3GPL, WA1JXN, WA1JXN/C6A, ZF2OC/ZF8, E51SIX, 3D2LR, 5W0GJ, E6M, TX5K, KH8/W7GJ, V6M, T8GJ, VK9CGJ, VK9XGJ, C21GJ, CP1GJ, S79GJ, TX7MB, TO7GJ)
P.O. Box 73
Frenchtown, MT 59834-0073
USA
TEL: (406) 626-5728
QTH: DN27ub
URL:http://www.bigskyspaces.com/w7gj
Skype: lanceW7GJ
2m DXCC #11 - 6m DXCC #815 - FFMA #7
Interested in 6m EME? Ask me about subscribing to the new Magic Band EME
email group, or just fill in the request box at the bottom of my web
page (above)!
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The coming weekend Feb 25-26th is the CW-SSB contest organised by DUBUS and REF on 2m and 70cm.
Everyone is welcome, this is not just an Eu contest. As Joe DL8HCZ has said, this will be the last 2m CW contest, too few entries.
If you want to see a 70cm CW contest continue, get on the moon, make some QSOs and send in an entry, Rules at http://www.marsport.org.uk/dubus/EMEContest2023new.pdf. It is a “daylight moon” so the hours are not difficult. Weather here looks OK so I shall be QRV with my 6m dish and full polarisation rotation.
Title pretty mush says it. I'm looking for Arduino code which calculates Az and El values for the moon. I'm sure it exists somewhere in the public domain, but I have not yet found a link to it.
Thanks
Bob, KA1GT
